Should killers get whole life tariffs?

I don't think I could live in a country that deliberatly killed its own citizens. We're supposed to be better people than those that we judge, executing them brutalises all of us and brings us down to the same level as the criminal.

And just as a matter of fact, people tend to confuse our membership of the European Union with our membership of the Council of Europe which gave us the European Convention on Human Rights. They are not the same thing, the ECHR was signed after the second world war, by those that had seen the most despicable things done by states to their citizens and they were keen to have structures in place so that such things could never happen again. The rights we have under that convention were earned by the blood of our grandparents and we give them up at our peril.

You can't pick and choose from the list - back out of one and you lose them all. Are you sure you want to lose this?

Article 2 | Right to life

Article 3 | Anti-torture and inhumane treatment

Article 4 | Anti-slavery

Article 5 | Right to liberty and security of the person

Article 6 | Right to a fair trial

Article 7 | Anti-retrospective conviction

Article 8 | Right to private and family life

Article 9 | Right to freedom of thought, conscience and religion

Article 10 | Right to freedom of expression

Article 11 | Right to freedom of assembly and association

Article 12 | Right to marriage

Article 13 | Right to an effective remedy

Article 14 | Anti-discrimination

Protocol 1 Article 1 | Right to peaceful enjoyment of property

Protocol 1 Article 3 | Duty to provide fair and free elections

Protocol 2 Article 1 | Right to education

Due to the amount of police corruption in this country, which is becoming more and more apparent on a daily basis nowadays. I think the death penalty should be left well alone. There use to be a very good investigative television show, cannot remember what it was called, fronted by a David or Derek Jessel I think. Many times this show proved that the police had either got it completely wrong or had just blatantly stitched somebody up. Most of the people who had been featured on this show would have been executed had the death penalty still been used at the time........

Also I think you can only be in favour of the death penalty, if you are willing to carry out the punishment yourself, why expect others to carry out your wishes?  Which kind of makes it even more confusing for me, because if your in favour of the death penalty you must also have the killer instinct yourself. So as an executioner on behalf of the state, you'd end up killing more people than what your customers had....

Albert Pierrepoint Born in 1905, lived in Clayton, Bradford. His father and uncle were part time executioners and this occupation became his goal as a young child. He liked to have a drink in the local working men's club and I am told my dad and grandad both knew him. He was accredited with dispatching over 400 prisoners.... I think a film called the last hangman was released in 2005, I am going to find it and watch it. 

Feedback to follow....

Heard of the film, never bothered before but may track it down as well. See if it makes you think or is a hollywood farce. Did you watch it? Interesting family connections.

Just watched it, very interesting...thought provoking and very English. The credits claim he hung 608 people, it also quotes him as saying all he achieved was revenge on behalf of the state. 

As it changed my views? No, even though he dealt with nazi concentration camp personnel following the Nuremberg trials. I still don't think the death penalty serves any useful purpose beyond the notion of revenge and retribution. We should be above that and treat people as human beings no matter how disturbed they may be. 

Still not sure my mind has been swayed from imposing the death sentence ..

Think someone quoted £50,000 to keep a prisoner locked up - 20 years later it would have cost 1million of tax payers money, thats just 1 prisoner - now a fee of £2.50 for a quick jolt of electric, arent we saving money??? Its not about blood lust, its about if a person offers anything to the society that he/she deemed not to tow the Law of the land and as such why should they be allowed back in to it

Story broke over the weekend about a prisoner, affectionately known as Skullcracker - 13 life sentences yet he was in an open prison scan reading the story something to do with parole - how can a prisoner with 13 life sentences ever see freedom?

Our so called Justice system is totally in the favour of the criminal it seems. Make prisons not a nice place and kill off a few of the long term lifers, surely the shock of this will make people think twice about committing murder?

Are you sure? Revenge is the usual motive for the death penalty when all other rationalisations are swept away, like cost and deterrence. I can understand the need for it, I just don't think it helps us as a society. All the evidence we have, tells us that the death penalty doesn't deter, it's as simple as that. What we're left with, as I say, is revenge.

The American system costs more to execute someone than keep them in prison for 30 years. This is because they need specialist, high security prisons just for them and the appeals process takes 20 years or more and is also very expensive.

Our Society is dissolving in to a race whereby we have little or no fear of the law, take the riots a couple of years ago, ok they managed to track a few of the culprits down but the vast majority are sat there with 2 fingers to the rest of the society that wants law & order.

There's talk today of increasing the sentence if you kill someone if driving whilst disqualified - why on earth are you driving at all if you are banned? If you get caught all that happens usually is you get a further ban - what a joke. Little point in adding points to the licence, thats assuming they have one and its doubtful they will bother insuring the car - all points to the law abiding citizen paying out more.

There was talk of over crowded prisons in another thread, kill a load of the lifers off, make room for the lesser crimes and extend sentencing to actually reflect the time you are supposed to serve, not just half for good behavior  - break the law, expect to be punished and spend a long time in jail.

Go back 50 years, there wasnt half the kind of disgusting crime that goes on today, there was fear of the law. If you are in jail you should lose all human rights & privileges much like the fact they gave no thought of their victims rights or what effect the crime has on their life.

Fed up with all these tree hugging idiots in Brussels (and this Country) telling us how we can & cant run our Country. Prison should be fearful place with no rights, hard work and a deterrent to keep Society a nicer place to live.

It is an emotive subject on both sides of the fence, but not so sure about this point. We live in age of instant news regurgitated continually 24 hours a day, and if the Guardian is to be believed, Crime has dropped 15% with violent crime down 22%.

Think you are selectivity reading this article though - 

Quote from the Guardians article noted in Steves post -

" The detailed police recorded crime figures also report a 17% rise in sexual offences including a 20% rise in rape to 19,214, the highest level for a decade.

The large rise in rapes and other sexual offences was partly due to increases in offences involving children, according to statisticians. The police figures record 13,090 sexual offences involving a child under the age of 13 in 2013, the highest reported total for a decade, and an increase of 32% on the previous 12 months. They include a 54% increase in rapes and sexual assaults on boys under 13 which rose from 1,775 to 2,727 last year. The number of sexual attacks on girls under 13 rose by 25% to 7,611 last year"

But some other crimes do seem to be down, so this maybe skewing the figures as a general overall figure?